Have you been tricked?
The laws of the universe have built you and given you a mind which appears to “think for itself”.
The mind you have knows enough to survive and reproduce, and it was built to do this. It knows what it wants, but it doesn’t know what it is!
It is not designed to know the truth of what it is, or what it is really doing. The truth doesn’t matter, only results do, such as surviving and reproducing.
So natural selection has not given you a mind which is party to what is true. For example: it is using desire, repulsion, pain, pleasure, thirst and hunger to promote reproduction, or hunting for food. Rather than explaining to you the need to create new life and how to do it, or to shop, or hunt for proteins or carbohydrates to maintain your body and give you energy. It’s just “I’m hungry” and that “forces” you to do something about it.
Similarly, thirst can get painfully panicky if you don't obey-instead of a communication from mother nature saying “ water is needed “.
Physical harm triggers physical pain as a punishment for causing that harm. It doesn't explain about the damage of burns, cuts, broken bones etc - it just doles out pain by the bucket load according to the damage.
You don't get knowledge or truth from mother nature - only cruel manipulation in the form of pleasure or pain to make you do what is required for evolution to continue at its best.
But: mother nature isn’t really cruel, and even doesn’t know that she is doing that. Things just happen by themselves.
Nothing is controlling anything.
Everything just happens!
Can Thought be True
The self-refuting nature of determinism is about the refutation of rational thought by determinism itself.
How could a determined thought be lucky enough to be rationally true? If a thought is not constructed by individual logic, where is the rationality?
If a determined thought is constructed by previous thoughts and ideas, could this be a rational process as well as a determined process?
Can one determined thought lead to another determined thought in a process that is consistent and logical?
Can anything be determined and also follow some other reasoning goal such as truth or meaning.
Thought may be out of human beings’ hands, but still follow a path determined by natural laws of physics.
But why would physical laws have an interest in logical or truthful thought or gaining knowledge?
Is there an answer to this?
Unconsciousness
Everything is really unconscious.
What thoughts or images play across the screen of consciousness?
What will you think next?
What will you say next?
All are unconsciously decided.
Do What You Want
As they say - you can do what you want, but you can't want what you want .
Even the existence of consciousness having evolved as an adaptation of a control mechanism for living things is understandable. Even then further: the development of a central identity that feels things and thinks things, as a further adaptation to facilitate avoidance of damage (e.g. pain), and taking advantage of opportunities (e.g. desire). Abstract qualities that have evolved by natural selection.
But the most mystifying quality is that of subjective awareness itself in the present moment like now! - writing this, being alive, eating, breathing, talking, now! In this moment - the feeling that goes with this present awareness.
It's normal and mechanical for it to happen, according to laws of determinism, but to feel aware and alive as someone, seems something else again. Something outside of an adaptive quality of evolution, or even something outside matter, space and time .
Yet adaptation and evolution have no idea what they are creating. The process is simply chemical change in genes, and anything that works better is selected for. It doesn't have to be true. It just has to improve chances of natural selection. It just has to work.
DNA and evolution have no idea they have created a concentrated source of consciousness manifesting subjective awareness and identity, which appears to experience things personally.
And even more astounding is the fact of determinism when applied to this so-called “person", this subjective experience. The very thoughts this so-called “person” has, are already determined by the universe. The person (e.g. me now) writing this, is thinking that their thoughts and ideas are being created by their own ability to ponder and work things out. But it is really the case that all these thoughts are occurring word for word, by determined electrochemical reactions in the brain. The person thinks and believes they are made by their own spontaneous awareness and could have been different if
they chose. But determinism dictates that all material events are the result of previous material events. There is nothing else.
So a person (say me now), realizing the truth of this, must suddenly stop dead with the realisation that what they are thinking, word for word, is a predetermined foregone conclusion. So there's no point in thinking any further.
But further thinking does occur, because that is what is determined. Realisations and insights into the nature of thought are just as determined as ignorance of how thought works and the false conclusions drawn.
Determinism reveals that the universe, including you and me, goes along automatically with no autonomous influence from anything since it was set in motion. It does it all by itself.
The problem can now be seen to be that determined “I” or “me” believes it is doing things. That is what is determined. I am determined to believe I am doing things in the world, when I'm actually not. This mistaken belief is perfectly created by the deterministic universe.
All the above words, sentences and ideas are occurring in “my” mind as determined, and in the reader's mind also. But determined ideas have no goal or guarantee to be true.
So do all these words, sentences and ideas really represent anything that is true? Or do they mean anything at all? Presumably any reader interprets them in a determined way. So what can be discovered or described that’s bound to be true.
You could say that nothing is true, only determined!
So you would have to ask if there’s anything in a line of inquiry or scientific research that has meaning or logic at all. Given all is determined by physical chemical processes. Matter has no interest or abilities in terms of reason or knowledge. If they did exist, where could those qualities have come from?
You would have to say that as informational systems in living organisms became more and more complex, “truth” and “true” knowledge came to be recognised as a valuable adaptive tool within evolution.
Knowledge systems must have self-booted and come up with strategies of logic and reason that worked in the environment. These, combined with subjective awareness owning the thinking processes, seemed like real individuals doing the thinking, deciding and choosing.
This has led to a society of molecular machines that cooperate and communicate, and feel and believe they are the agents doing it all. Whereas what must in truth be really happening, is that physical determinism is doing it all, as it has done from day one.
There is no other agency than physical law governing physical matter.
All matter has already been set in motion, and all that can happen is from then on it obeys the laws of physics.
Nothing else is involved or exists and this world is the result.
The thing is, the most amazing fact is, that an “I” exists. That you or I exist at all. All that humans accomplish could be done by robotic biological or mechanical machines, that have no “I” inside to be angry, sad or happy, or clever.
In fact you would have to say that all that humans accomplish is achieved without an “I” to run things. Because the “I” is simply a feeling of doership that goes along for the ride. It is created and used by evolution, along with bones, muscles and nerves as a survival tool for organisms.
Everything I do is done by the physical world and the “I” is also created by the physical world. Thinking or desiring is experienced in the mind, as “I”, but the actual decisions, concepts and actions are carried out automatically, according to the laws of physics.
Most animals and plants are completely unaware of their lives, and yet live perfectly well according to their physical metabolism.
In humans things are done through the “I”, but not by the “I”.
For instance the “I” is useful for social interactions. Say your thirsty,- very very thirsty, and you are desperate for a drink. You are strongly desiring a drink, and thinking I must get a drink of something, and you think about how. When you get the drink you feel satiated and almost a joy in quenching the thirst.
The whole process of getting liquid into the body is a personal experience in the mind. This also occurs for lesser levels of thirst and for many needs of the body.
The “I” has evolved as a sort of center which can be made to feel good, bad, happy, sad, proud, guilty and so on, and these are signals that the body needs to do something - to take action.
Emotions and feelings are powerful motivating forces that force the body to act and this is often done through an “I”.
However, various animals and plants can take in water without it being signaled by a feeling of thirst, and without an involved “I”.
Not a Single Thing
You can’t say a single thing without it already being determined, and thus the result of the past, rather than you.
As all particles obey rules and everything was set in place at the big bang, the rest is history.
Lots of people realize this and realize there can be no such thing as free will, only the feeling.
And then people (like me) go on and say things in favor of determinism because it’s true, and things against blame and praise and punishment because it’s based on the lie of free will.
But the first word I utter, or idea or keystroke on the laptop is already determined. The world is exactly as it is at this moment because it is determined to the last particle. One person ranting against free will, and another for free will is already determined. Determinism is in place before, during and after each moment. Determinism is the prime mover and any discussion about it is also determined.
So the problem of how to understand how the world operates, while living a life in it, is much more difficult than can be possibly imagined.
You are determined to think and feel you have free will, and even to choose to believe in determinism. But determinism got there first. Determinism dictates your every move. Including anything you believe, or someone else believes.
The world can’t be better or different. The number of people believing what they believe is exactly as it is due to the laws of nature. But even if you try to spread the belief in determinism to create a better world, that’s perfectly OK too, because that’s also determined.
Coming from a free will and free choice view of the world, everything we do is sensible because it agrees with our determined feelings. But from a deterministic view of the world everything we do is ridiculous, because it is based on the genetically determined false premise of free will and choice.
So to us sentient beings, what is true (determinism) feels ridiculous, and what is false (free will) feels right and true.
We are upside down and back to front, and to try and understand that on the hop, and not just as a theory, is the most significant and beautiful challenge a human being could be determined to undertake.
What to think
Given the determined mind/brain, what you should be thinking about, and deciding on, and what others should be thinking about is all out the window. There is only what you or others think as has been determined.
Even the above considerations and ideas are totally arising from previous causes, and those causes are simply the effects of even earlier causes.
You might fear losing your drive and ambition because what will happen will happen so why try? But try or not, that will be determined. You may sit on the couch forever after believing in determinism. But that would be determined, not a choice up to you.
Likewise you might fire up and throw yourself into a project as a result of coming across the philosophy of determinism (I did). This is also determined in spite of feeling as if it was a powerful personal choice.
Whatever happens is already determined and influences and learning may seem to set your mind on a course to take, but the influences themselves were determined, and thus, so are any resulting actions.
Something Else
The combination of hard determinism and biological evolution traps us in a very awkward place. We have been constructed by something else, and every move is carried out by something else. Every move. Every thought. Every outcome. All done by something else, other than me. Even the me is done by the something else, meaning there is no me, apart from something else acting as a me.
What Thought of Thinking?
You would have to think that something thought of thinking in the first place. Before creating it.
How could conscious, thought, thinking, subjectivity and a self, just happen?
Even to try to understand is hard work. You have to find the science (for laypersons) and look up the dictionary and read around then still choose what can or cannot be believed.
What is not known and what is not understandable to the layperson has to be taken on trust. It’s hard work but you can inch your way forward, discarding most philosophies and books as you go.
For every theory there’s an anti theory and as you wade through, things get simpler and a lot less. In the end there's only particles. That’s all there is. And the particles interact in their own way as they have always done, according to the laws of physics, the laws of nature.Bodies are particles and so are brains and thought consists of chemical and electrical interactions of particles as observed by science.
Thought is not understood, yet enough is known to predict there will be no surprises and it will be explained in terms of physics. The subjective self and introspection are elusive and complicated, yet originate via the chain of biological and social evolution.
You can’t identify or read a thought by looking at its particles interacting, not yet, but you can be sure they’re connected and are the same thing.
Be Determined
There is no deeper understanding or greater understanding, only determined understanding.
Because all thought is determined it may seem silly to try and get a grasp on, and understand determinism. But that scenario is determined to occur, or not. So relax and be determined.
Self Refutation
It’s not so much “self refutation” with regard to philosophical arguments about determinism. That is, one person accusing the other of presenting a theory that refutes itself - that also.
But it’s more about one person thinking in their own mind about determinism, or any other thought or argument they felt they chose to adopt, or thought up.
Given determinism to be true, those thoughts refute themselves from the beginning, because any determined thought comes from elsewhere. It is caused by the past, it is not created or discovered or thought up by the person. A person thinks they can think anything they want, but thoughts are determined (being matter in motion) and so any thought language is self-refuting.
Nothing Known
There is all this thinking and logic and reasoning, and gradual understanding. But none of it is required.
Remove humans and the universe goes on. But with no thinking.
Thinking and working it out, successfully or not, is an unnecessary extra in the universe. It’s even a burden to the creatures that think they think.
Then remove the lesser consciousness of dogs and dolphins and others and the world still goes on, but now no-one knows anything about it. No thing knows. Things only are.
As far as knowing is concerned, there is no difference between there being a world without consciousness - and nothing. There would only be a world that no-one or no-thing knows about. A world totally unknown is nothing.
Or is it? It could have potential. If an unknown world gradually develops its own consciousness, and its own subjective experience, like ours did, it ends up exactly like this world.
That’s what this world did. Something from nothing. Everything from nothing. That’s what this world and this universe did. Unknown matter became life which became mind and then nothing became known - by itself.
Matter grew to know itself.
Thinking Determined Thoughts
Some prominent hard determinists say the criminal justice system should change because human behaviour is determined, and not carried out by free will. So punishment is not justified. Only rehabilitation is.
But my own view would be: yes! rehabilitation should replace punishment. However, how people view determinism and its effect on the criminal justice system is already determined.
That view of mine is determined. As are some peoples’ views that criminals should be punished. As are other peoples’ views that society should think differently about crime and punishment.
So can things be thought about? Well they are, but each thought is determined, even this thought, this idea.
So you can’t get to the sensible, right answer because every thought along the way is determined for you, including the conclusion. Someone else may come to the “wrong” conclusion but this would also be determined. Exactly how many people in the world view punishment as deserved or undeserved is determined, and if that is changing, that also is determined.
What is a Determined Thought?
A determined thought is any thought because everything in the universe is determined.
An empty mind or “pure awareness” is also a determined experience.
Our only experience is mental: the senses, awareness, introspection, thought process, and thought content are all determined. So the intent to explore the meaning and consequences of determinism is impossible. It’s not possible to have any freedom from determinism in which to explore life from any angle, only to do what’s determined.
Determinism rules before the next thought, which is now. We are all living our lives in total perfection and obedience to the natural law.
The Universe Doing it
The universe is a mass of interacting particles obeying rigidly determined laws. And life within the universe is the same.
Living and non-living things are matter doing the same thing - obeying the same laws.
The “thinking” going on as I write or read this, is the universe doing it - not me.
The universe includes the thought “I am doing the thinking”.
Only What Occurs
The understanding (or not), would appear in your thoughts. Your thoughts are you. If your first thought is “hang the bastard”, then that is a normal thought, determined, but not one arising from understanding the truth of existence.
If your first thought is “this thought is determined yet it seems freely willed by me - so what am I? Then that is a thought apparently arising from an understanding of the process of what you really are.
Yet that thought, too, is determined. So where is there room for understanding in determinism? Wrong understanding is just as determined as right understanding, if either exists.
It appears that because all thought is determined, there is no freedom to understand or not. So there may be no truth, only what occurs, determined by the universe itself in the beginning.
It Seems Real
Almost every conclusion revealed by science and determinism is easy to understand and accept. Matter, energy, the structure of the universe, life and even consciousness. How it all happens and how it is.
The very difficult area to understand is that of subjective awareness.
That subjective awareness evolved as an evolutionary adaptation, is ungraspable, but the hard part is to acknowledge or realize that my very experience of introspection is an illusion. Determinism and materialism say I am only particles interacting, all the way to the mind. Yet the mind cannot live that truth. It still carries on as though it’s really a someone with free will, purpose and goals to act out.
So given science’s discoveries in terms of a deterministic world, everything has been revealed, or the path to understanding has been seen as within reach without resorting to supernatural explanations. It’s all done and dusted.
Yet the incredibly overwhelming feeling of free will and personal choice, from thoughts to actions, remains.
The universe is mechanical and life robotic, yet the subjective experience of introspective awareness and agency, goes wholly against this truth.
Subjective experience has evolved as an adaptation by natural selection for increased survival and reproduction in a co-operating society of individuals.
The feeling of agency itself is an illusion. The feeling is true but the agency is not, and that combination seems to work as a successful adaptation for survival.
Personally, my problem is that an illusory me exists and it feels real. The world is full of illusory “me”s or “I”s or “you”s interacting.
The human body and brain are real, the feeling of free will is real but humans interact automatically and robotically. There is really no-one, and no freedom or will, only the feelings that there is. Exactly how much of this truth can be absorbed by the illusory I is unknown.
And although the illusory I seems to be the experiencer and the one trying to understand, how can it be if it's illusory.
Is silent emptiness, free of thought, the ultimate truth? Or at least the denial of the illusion.
Consciousness or Nothing
Without consciousness nothing exists. Without consciousness nothing registers anything, nothing sees or hears anything. Nothing wonders about anything, or finds out or understands anything. Nothing holds the memory of anything.
Without consciousness, there is nothing, and there is nothing to know even that’ Just nothing.
And as far as your or my consciousness is concerned, when that disappears, as it will, there is nothing for you or me to know or remember anything about anything.
When that ending of you or me happens, there is the same total nothing as if all consciousness disappeared everywhere. As if there was none in the first place.
Illusion of Self
What I feel I am and what I think I am is not what I actually am.I actually am the scientific description of myself. An evolved mammal with an embedded illusion of a self.
The illusion of self is so powerful and so profound it is a wonder that we can think of an alternative, even for a moment,
Yet the illusion of self can be present while investigating that illusion.
You would have to ask if an illusion can do anything at all, so it could be non-conscious processing by the human brain that does it all.
But it doesn’t feel like that. Hence the illusion.
Input/output
It’s all input/output, not thought at work thinking about things.
Really - there’s no-one that knows what they’re doing There’s no-one or nothing that knows the “language” of the brain. There’s only input/output built up by life experience. You aren’t doing it by thinking and choosing.
Mother nature or evolution aren’t entities that can know what they are doing. Evolution is physics silently a work with no plan or purpose. Just unfolding according to physical laws.
My feeling that I am someone doing and experiencing also projects doing and experiencing onto life and objects in the rest of the world. But nothing is experiencing or doing anything.
The universe doesn’t even know it has built life or created life. Life itself doesn’t even know it has been created. It just appears to.
Evolution has no idea of Christmas. It has no thought or plan or knowledge of breathing. It's just that breathing has evolved by a silent and blind process of natural selection.
My (and your) mind is another matter. Much more personal and important and hard to include as physical matter interacting. But not only is it purely physical matter interacting, but it has no self autonomy. It is the result of interactions, not the cause of interactions.
Celebrating Christmas, breathing, thinking and choosing are all results of determined physical interactions in the universe.
The mind can’t believe this as it is set up not to. It is set up to believe exactly what it does believe according to the past.
Yet even this smacks of purpose, of which there isn’t. The mind is like a slime blob that evolved to have its complicated form.
Brain Language
What is the language the brain uses? How does it use stored memory to interact with the world?
It doesn’t actually use memory, it just interacts.
Stored memory is the world as you experience it.
Communication Between Minds
When you ask a person a question - what is actually happening? It could be said that “my computer” is inputting to “your computer” with a question (search enquiry), and your computer responds with its own exact response. Input/output.
The idea that I, or you, deeply thought about or considered our questions and answers according to our personalities and beliefs is not necessary. Only that there’s input (question) and output (answer).
This process can be seen as beyond people talking and chatting to computers connecting and exchanging information. Each computer “knows” only what it does and responds accordingly.
Thinking of Self
Think of a drone flying automatically and avoiding obstacles.
Think of a dragonfly doing the same.
Think of a human walking in the street as the same.
Think of a human walking in a supermarket and shopping as the same.
Think of a human thinking thoughts as automatic behaviour.
Think of yourself introspecting as the same.
Think of yourself reading this now as the same.
Where is the self doing it?
Self Autonomy
If evolution produces a sense of self that exists along with the body, but can’t access any information about how the brain produces thoughts and actions - then that sense of self will think it is doing everything instead of the inner, hidden mechanical processes.
It becomes a very confident self, interacting with other confident selves, creating a society of automatons, believing they are free willed persons.
Self Awareness
What is interesting is not so much the observations, opinions and interpretations going on in our subjective consciousness, but the very simple experience of awareness itself. Awareness of being aware, awareness of the senses, awareness of being, itself. A tiny localised awareness looking without and looking within. And despite all its extreme limitations it is all encompassing. It is all there is.
Are we saying this awareness is an illusion (ie non existent) and the determined world carries on mechanically, without anything?
The Biased Self
The self is not a good investigator into what we really are. The desires, judgements, goals, morals and human responsibilities, totally get in the way. The self is so busy dealing with life, its biases prevent it from glimpsing, developing and believing in a true understanding of what we are (what I am).
The Self that Searches
The self is determined. It is not really a free self as it feels it is. It is the self that searches because it believes it exists and it wants to know more about itself’
But an illusion doesn’t exist. Yet it carries on. The self is a determined illusion, not an illusion that can do things.
The illusion part is that it feels like a self exists and it feels like me! And it feels like “I” understand the above, but this is all a determined illusion of nature that has evolved over time.
Nature obviously intends us to think our thoughts are created by us. As well as acted upon by our own choices. This is also determined. Evolution has selected for these qualities. Or rather, these beliefs. The self is deeply engrained.
Thinking You’re Thinking
Thinking you’re thinking is the first and last problem.
“I think therefore I am”, is the first mistake. Yet this mistake is compulsory - foisted upon us by nature.
“I only think I think. Therefore I am not” is the truth that can be thought and even believed, but not experienced.
If the self does not really exist - how can it know this? To know it doesn’t exist, it would have to exist.
True All Along
It’s not that when I realise the scientific truth of how the world operates, that then I will have a new understanding, and be able to ponder about things from this new perspective.
It’s that the “new” perspective has been true all along.
Any realizing, or not, of it, is already it, and to even think about it is it thinking.
Computers
The fact that we are computers
And not thinkers
Is continually hidden from us
Every moment.
We are computers
Thinking we are thinkers
Even when we get that.
And even when we get it
It’s still a computer
That gets it.
Already too Late
The belief in the slightest hint of an opinion is already too much.
The self thinking, and the opinion itself, are determined events.
Even “catching yourself” engrossed in the self and it’s thoughts, is totally determined.
When you say: “I am determined”, it’s already too late.